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Post by soren on Apr 1, 2011 11:46:52 GMT -5
summerhawk - i agree, and of course if Kamatis Na Ligaw is indeed the correct name, I will use that too. But so far I have not seen any evidence that it is.
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surf4grrl
Tomato Gardener
Head Growerouter
Organic farmer
Posts: 99
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Post by surf4grrl on Apr 1, 2011 12:09:23 GMT -5
Summerhawk, relax - unless you can do a DNA test on your tomato - you should call your tomato the name it was given by your seed source. I'm not in favor of re-naming tomatoes - no matter how similar it looks. It's common to say "tomato x" aka "commonly called" name/ or thought to be... (see tatiana's site)
Half the trouble with tomatoes is folks re-naming them because they look similar etc etc.
I think HBP's thread on "heirloom apparitions" is a good one and should be revisited. However, there's no conclusive evidence these two tomatoes are identical, nor the shenanigans of a unsavory seed saver. (say that 3 times fast...)
If it's not OK to re-name tomatoes, (& that's HBP's contention) - then it's not OK to re-name them.
I see it that once you start re-naming tomatoes then the task becomes arbitrary unless you can absolutely prove they are the same.
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hillbillypie
Breeder in Training
Tomato Growing Nutjob
Posts: 210
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Post by hillbillypie on Apr 1, 2011 13:09:30 GMT -5
I don't know how to answer the question about my "source". Funny how some of the "tomato experts" never have to answer this question. The reason I can't answer is that I don't remember. I just know it in the same way that I know what an aphid is or what the N-P-K numbers mean. I have been growing tomatoes even before there was a Cherokee Purple and Al Gore invented the Internet. I have studied a lot of info about tomatoes over the last 2 decades. Mostly what I was interested in was isolated L. esculentum populations and Lycopersicum species and not as much about widely cultivated or heirloom varieties. Because of the high heat and humidity we experience where I live, anything to do with a tomato (or other food crop) that comes from a humid tropical region would get my attention. It was a scientific interest that I have enjoyed off and on for quite some time. I have read more papers on plants than I care to think about and I don't remember where I read everything that I have knowledge of. If I was guessing it was probably something that was written by someone from the U of Hawaii, but it just as easily could have been an old paper from Ohio State or from the Florida State program. I just don't remember. Soren I have no beef with you and I wasn't trying to start a pissing contest. I basically said the same thing you said, just used a different example. It was a tongue in cheek silly comment and I apologize for offending you. My opinion is that people do this all the time. For some reason it is allowed at times and frowned upon at others. It mostly depends on who is doing the naming and again points to the ridiculous hypocrisy within this hobby. I really don't care. I don't have a dog in this fight. I was only trying to share a bit of info that I had that seemed to be missing from what was posted. I said what I know to be true. If you don't believe it, then perhaps you are right and I am wrong. It is always a possibility that what I know is wrong. I don't want to be "that guy" and certainly don't want to be known as a "know it all". I actually thought someone would WANT to know that this variety was probably a mispronounced or misspelled name. You know like that Elton John song, "hold me closer Tony Danza" ? I assure you that I will not interject what I think I might know into any more posts. Best of luck and I hope your Kamatis Tagalog fills your garden with fruit. In the words of Pink Floyd, "we don't need no education, we don't need no birth control"....umm.... at least that's what I heard. I'm out of this conversation.
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maf
Breeder in Training
Posts: 102
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Post by maf on Apr 1, 2011 16:06:34 GMT -5
Considering the history of this escaped variety it is quite possible that it is called Kamatis Na Ligaw in one part of the Phillipines and Kamatis Tagalog in another. Wild growing plants always attract regional common names, why would this be any different?
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Post by willyswoodpile on Apr 1, 2011 17:09:43 GMT -5
When my mother makes out a grocery list she always writes "tomatoes".
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Post by blane on Apr 1, 2011 20:07:35 GMT -5
Hawk....good type my friend! You wont lose any friends over this.... My latest update- I think they are taking on a rugose shape...Ill get ya a pic this weekend
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Post by darthslater on Apr 1, 2011 20:17:43 GMT -5
Wouldn't it make for some real convo to find that Cherokee Purple is in reality, Fillipino#2!? Imagine the egg on faces....the pure Chaos...The back peddeling for a fairy tale story gone bad!! What would they think...what would they say..... A little while back there was some talk about Indian Stripe, saying that it was perhaps related to Cherokee purple..there were also comments made to the effect that Indian Stripe didn't achieve the size of Cherokee purple, that proved to be a falisy as well. Last year I grew the 2 side by side and they were very close..in fact the larger tomatoes were IS. I obtained my seed from Bill {Pap} Jeffers who has been selecting for size and earliness. His source was the freezer of Clyde Bureson {Not sure of the spelling}. So.. I am sure we would all benefit fron DNA testing..but until that happens we will have to abide the "Fairy Tale Factors". They refering to the tomato experts.
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Post by blane on Apr 1, 2011 20:29:50 GMT -5
Wouldn't it make for some real convo to find that Cherokee Purple is in reality, Fillipino#2!? Imagine the egg on faces....the pure Chaos...The back peddeling for a fairy tale story gone bad!! What would they think...what would they say..... Those that you refer to as "They".... ? I dont know, this could take a Decade or more, and many wont like it!
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Post by jbosmith on Apr 2, 2011 7:34:08 GMT -5
I think you could include "May also be called..." in the description but I wouldn't even guess about renaming it until you can grow the two side by side. Until then I'd stick with what you know.
Also, Def Leopard's song where they sing "Poison sugar on bread" and Aerosmith's Dream On ("Sing women, sing for the years..") are both pretty good.
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Post by blane on Apr 2, 2011 7:47:02 GMT -5
CHEERS! ;D
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maf
Breeder in Training
Posts: 102
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Post by maf on Apr 2, 2011 9:21:35 GMT -5
"Scuse me while I kiss this guy"
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Post by willyswoodpile on Apr 2, 2011 12:58:28 GMT -5
CHEERS! ;D Is the climate in the Philippines similar to yours? If so these should do well for you. You are a growing machine Blane.
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Post by klorentz on Apr 5, 2011 16:35:33 GMT -5
Was just looking at the pics. The shape of the fruits remind me of Costoluto Genovese.
Kevin
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Post by jbosmith on Apr 5, 2011 20:28:09 GMT -5
snip Also, Def Leopard's song where they sing "Poison sugar on bread" snip I'm pretty sure that the line goes... "Pour some sugar on me" Yeah, Hillbilly's post about the Pink Floyd song amused me and made me think of this. The day I figured out what was really being said, the song made a lot more sense. The Aerosmith song started making more sense when he went from saying 'Sing women' to 'Sing with me' too!
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Post by jbosmith on Apr 5, 2011 20:28:41 GMT -5
I'm not usually one to care about folliage, but this is a nice plant!
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