Mystery Plum Saladette Tomato

[PVP]

In 2006, I crossed Brandywine x Neves Azorean Red.

In 2007, I grew the F1: s65.photobucket.com/albums/h212/PapaVic1948/?action=view¤t=MVC-014S-9.jpg

In 2008, I grew several F2 vines. One of them was a regular leaf red that looked like this:
s65.photobucket.com/albums/h212/PapaVic1948/?action=view¤t=MVC-002S-24.jpg

2009, I grew 10 vines from seeds from the F2 tomato shown in the 2008 picture above. Two of those vines gave me 2 - 3 ounce, red "saladette" tomatoes. I don't know where the stray pollen came from and I don't have any pictures of the plum saladette tomatoes.

Suze in Texas is growing some of the "F4" (although I suspect they actually are F3) vines from those 2 - 3 ounce plum saladette seeds I sent her. Take a look at her green fruit:
www.feldoncentral.com/garden/photos/v/memberphotos/suze/2010+garden/brand+x+pl+red+plum+f4+%231.jpg.html
www.feldoncentral.com/garden/photos/v/memberphotos/suze/2010+garden/brand+x+pl+red+plum+f4+%232.jpg.html

Looks to me like the stray pollen came from a variety with a "necked pear shape" tomato. What do y'all think?

The only necked pear shape fruit I have grown in the past several years is Yellow Submarine and Evan's Purple Plum. I have grown some paste tomatoes the same years as the Brandywine x NAR project, and those include Polish Pastel, Heidi, Amish Paste and Romeo.

But the most likely suspects are Yellow Sub and Evan's Purple Plum, considering the size and shape of 2009 and 2010 fruit. Does anyone know if Amish Paste, Heidi or Polish Pastel has the "neck gene?"

Darth has several plants from both the 2 oz. and the 3 oz. saladette PLs in his greenhouse. I only have 3 total vines in the ground and several still sitting in tubs out back with no prospective homes.

I'm very happy Suze got the necked pear expression as I understand that's a long shot.

Peace, PV

[PVP]

Okay, some questions for the professionals ...

1) What are the chances for a potato leaf F1 when crossing Yellow Submarine (a potato leaf yellow pear) with a Brandywine x NAR? The BWxNAR was a potato leaf recessive F2 if that makes any difference.

2) What are the chances for a slightly elongated plum F1 from that same cross? How about the chances for an elongated plum in the F2?

3) What are the chances for a necked pear F2 or F3 from that same cross?

4) What are the chances for a gold or orange F2 or F3 from that same cross?

These questions are posed because I know for a fact that I planted seeds and grew 10 plants from the same red, beefsteak tomato that grew on a regular leaf, F2 vine that came from the F1 cross of Brandywine x Neves Azorean Red. From those 10 "F2" plants, I got regular leaf and potato leaf, 100% red fruit, some elongated and some round, ranging in size from 2 ounces to four ounces, consistent size and shape on each vine throughout the season.

Today, Suze emailed me that some of the necked pear fruit is nearly ripe (at 69 days) and shows either gold or orange will be the full ripe color. The DTM is consistent with the 2-oz plum seed source which was the 1st of the 10 plants to ripen at about 72 - 75 days up here in Indiana last summer.

Last question: If last year's tomatoes were F1, were all the slight variations in fruit shapes and fruit sizes, and having both RL and PL vines, due to the F2 parent (BWxNAR) being 50/50 hetero/homo genetically?

This was not an intentional cross. I was growing what I thought were 10 segregating F3 plants from the selected large red beefsteak F2 BWxNAR. Now the only explanation I can give is a bee cross pollination from Yellow Submarine pollen in 2008, onto the F2 BWxNAR.


Peace, PV

[PVP]

Update: the BWxNAR (X?) (F?) vine growing in Elgin, TX gives necked pear tomatoes with yellow flesh, a yellow epidermis, a little over 2" long, and about 1.5" wide at the widest part. Very good flavor reported. Pictures soon.


Peace, PV

[PVP]

Suze says it's 1.5 - 2 ounces in size and taste a lot better than Yellow Pear. She hasn't grown the original Yellow Submarine that I know of, so she is not comparing it to Yellow Sub. except that the vine is PL.

[jcm05]

What a hideous plate!


;D

Geez, I HOPE it tasted better then YP.

[tomstrees]

Jun 1, 2010 12:15:44 GMT -5 PVP said:

Here's a picture of the ripe fruit: www.feldoncentral.com/garden/photos/v/memberphotos/suze/2010+garden/fruit/BW+x+NAR+x+unknown+pear.jpg.html

I suppose it's (Brandywine x NAR) F2 x Yellow Submarine, but I cannot say whether it is itself an F2 or an F3. All I know is the seed came out of a PL 2 oz. red plum saladette that I thought was a BWxNAR F3 and the only pear shaped yellow tomato I have grown in the past 35 years is Yellow Submarine.

Suze says it's 1.5 - 2 ounces in size and taste a lot better than Yellow Pear. She hasn't grown the original Yellow Submarine that I know of, so she is not comparing it to Yellow Sub. except that the vine is PL.

Darth started plants from several of the same seeds and we can wait to see what all he gets from this mystery cross.


Peace, PV

soooooo -
Suze got a yellow plum bigger than yellow sub ?
hows the flavor ? (they should be ripe down there in TX by now

~ Tom

[PVP]

Tom, as you can imagine, I certainly wasn't expecting a plum saladette from F3 Brandywine x Neves Azorean Red, much less to get a necked yellow pear in one of the F4s. Obviously a case of stray pollen onto an F2 beefsteak blossom from most likely Yellow Submarine as it was the only yellow pear I've grown in recent years and the other plum shaped tomatoes were larger and not yellow fleshed.

Anyway, yes the tomatoes in Texas are ripening and being eaten. Suze basically said that she, like Mule and some others, doesn't really care for most yellows, oranges or bicolors but this is one that she does like because it's a helluva lot better than Yellow Pear, and being bigger is another bonus.


Peace, PV

[tomstrees]

Jun 2, 2010 14:25:45 GMT -5 PVP said:

Tom, as you can imagine, I certainly wasn't expecting a plum saladette from F3 Brandywine x Neves Azorean Red, much less to get a necked yellow pear in one of the F4s. Obviously a case of stray pollen onto an F2 beefsteak blossom from most likely Yellow Submarine as it was the only yellow pear I've grown in recent years and the other plum shaped tomatoes were larger and not yellow fleshed.

Anyway, yes the tomatoes in Texas are ripening and being eaten. Suze basically said that she, like Mule and some others, doesn't really care for most yellows, oranges or bicolors but this is one that she does like because it's a helluva lot better than Yellow Pear, and being bigger is another bonus.


Peace, PV

so sad - no love for yeller or orange -

but hmmmm -
take that yeller plum and x with "old ivory egg" and grow with the PL - I'd be interested in F1's of that