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Post by blackthumb on Jun 20, 2010 23:08:25 GMT -5
Three products that can help. Actinovate Agri-Fos (Exel LG, same product different name) Regalia (Extract from the Giant Knotweed plant) I've used the first two with good results and from what I have read about the third is very promising. All 3 are Bio-friendly. I also use Azoxystrobin which is derived from mushrooms which is locally available here in Germany but in the states it is only commercially available from what I could find. Ami Thanks; educational and interesting. "Fungicides can either be contact, translaminar or systemic. ...." Thanks for the refresher. I either forgot or didn't know what translaminar meant. That's a new one on me. I know for a fact Azoxystobin and Phosphorous Acid (Agri-Fos/Exel LG) are labeled for use on tomatoes and both their modes of action are Systemic! Thanks; I didn't know that there were systemic fungicides approved for tomatoes. I picked up a bottle of Agri-Fos (Azoxystobin and Phosphorous Acid). Do I understand correctly that that should help prevent and/or combat late blight? Dave, I believe the increased popularity of Organic/Home grown produce is a result of peoples distrust as to how commercial growers (non organic) grow, fertilize and the pesticides used on there crops. At least we backyard gardeners have a choice in those areas. And I have done a lot of reading on Mycrobial Biofertilizers and Biopesticide/fungicides. This year I'm using several on my tomato grow outs. "Biota Max" is one, EM (Effective Microorganisms) is another and a couple products from "BioStart" which are Microbial Soil Inoculants called "Defensor" and "RhizoBoost". I'm also using my normal Mycorrhiza and Actinovate inoculants as well. Ami I tried a similar product called bio-tone; and haven't noticed any benefits. Though I had no control group and there were too many variables for me to have any strong scientific conclusions.
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amideutch
Breeder in Training
Golden Cherokee
Posts: 139
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Post by amideutch on Jun 21, 2010 13:02:06 GMT -5
Bthumb, read the last post page 2 this thread by me. Ami
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Post by blackthumb on Jun 21, 2010 13:36:14 GMT -5
Foliar/topical fungicides like Agri-Fos: I was wondering if they wash off in rain as easily as most “contact” fungicides. I get the impression that Agri-Fos does not wash off in the rain like most fungicides.
I find one of the irritating things about trying to prevent and fight late blight is that it often happens when there is frequent rains; and it seems most of the common cheap suggested fungicides for late blight typically wash off in the rain and need reapplication after the rain. I think on some of the fungicides there are limits per season use of something like seven applications, so I think it would be easy to run into conundrums; where if you apply more (or more frequently to compensate for rain) you risk violating the law and/or exceeding contamination limits of the vegetables and the soil and possibly have a hazardous situation; however if you stop treating then you increase the odds that your crops will succumb to diseases like late blight. So to me it seems to make more sense to use a systemic fungicide like Agri-Fos (assuming it is effective for late blight. The label says it is for late blight so I am assuming it is effective to some degree)/
Analogy.
Many flea medications for dogs will wash off in the rain or if the dog swims. That's partly why I prefer a systemic flea medication like frontline; because the way I understand it after it dries off after it is applied topically it is absorbed and becomes systemic and for the most part can't be washed off.
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Post by blackthumb on Jun 21, 2010 13:44:44 GMT -5
Bthumb, read the last post page 2 this thread by me. Ami I read it, but I'm not sure if I understand it. It seems to suggest that it is probably effective for late blight; but it doesn't seem to come out and directly say it. It seems to suggest that it is effective on the category of blight, but it doesn't seem to directly address late blight. The language seems highly technical and somewhat vague to be litigative. It seems as if it is trying to suggest that it is effective on late blight; but for some reason it seems as if they are afraid to be direct. The label says it is used for late blight; but it does not commit to effectiveness.
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jcm05
Administrator
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Post by jcm05 on Jun 21, 2010 14:57:23 GMT -5
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amideutch
Breeder in Training
Golden Cherokee
Posts: 139
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Post by amideutch on Jun 22, 2010 12:29:21 GMT -5
If that's the case then you shouldn't waste your money on this product. Maybe you should use Azoxystrobin but alas it is only available to commercial growers. Or maybe Daconil is your cup of tea. But then again there is always the copper routine. Decisions, decisions and by the time you make them the plants will have withered and died!
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Post by blackthumb on Jun 22, 2010 21:23:04 GMT -5
Allegedly late blight found on potatoes in Michigan. Source and full story. www.nbc15.com/newsyoucanuse/headlines/96921144.html==== ==== ==== I would like to know if “Bacillus subtilis” (Serenade Garden Disease Control) and “Streptomyces lydicus” (Actinovate) can be used in combination with other fungicides. What I mean is can they be mixed up in the same spray tank and spray the foliage without a neutralizing effect or some form of harmful unwanted reaction/interaction? Can “Bacillus subtilis” (Serenade Garden Disease Control) be mixed and applied simultaneously with any of the following fungicides? 1: Copper fungicides (copper sulfate)? (Apparently yes) 2: Chlorothalonil (tetrachloroisophthalonitrile)? 3: Mancozeb (zinc ion and manganese ethylene bisdithiocarbamate ion)? 4: Maneb (manganese ethylene bisdithiocarbamate)? 5: Agri-fos (Mono- and di-potassium salts of Phosphorous Acid)? Can “Streptomyces lydicus” (Actinovate) be mixed and applied simultaneously with any of the following fungicides? 1: Copper fungicides (copper sulfate)? 2: Chlorothalonil (tetrachloroisophthalonitrile)? 3: Mancozeb (zinc ion and manganese ethylene bisdithiocarbamate ion)? 4: Maneb (manganese ethylene bisdithiocarbamate)? 5: Agri-fos (Mono- and di-potassium salts of Phosphorous Acid)? ====== edit/add: I found an article that seems to be credible that seems to be saying “Bacillus Subtilis” and “copper sulfate” can be mixed together and sprayed. I think I'll try this approach as it might prevent and/or reduce blight using two different methods ( inhibiting growth and inhibiting reproduction). webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:VyxKbyou6csJ:attra.ncat.org/attra-pub/lateblight.html+bacillus+subtilis+copper+fungicides+mix&cd=3&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=usPlease enlighten me if you know any other of these combinations that are compatible.
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swampr
Global Moderator
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Post by swampr on Jun 25, 2010 20:20:13 GMT -5
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Post by blackthumb on Jul 7, 2010 22:23:22 GMT -5
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Post by blackthumb on May 9, 2011 3:12:08 GMT -5
Last year I heard allegations that there were some fungicides that could cure plants infected with late blight. I can’t remember where I read it, but I think it was a reputable source. Supposedly the plants will still be damaged, but supposedly there are some fungicides that will stop late blight in its tracks. I seem to remember looking up the alleged fungicides and they were extremely expensive and only seemed to be available at a commercial/industrial level. I was wondering if these allegations are true and if any of these alleged fungicides are available yet in the US to the home gardener in a translaminar or systemic form?
If I recall correctly the fungicides were systemic.
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surf4grrl
Tomato Gardener
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Organic farmer
Posts: 99
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Post by surf4grrl on May 9, 2011 5:33:52 GMT -5
www.longislandhort.cornell.edu/vegpath/late_blight_pasa2011.pdfHere is a great article by an excellent pathologist who has done alot of work on LB. I don't know what else to say - folks ask for advice on culling volunteers to control it - of which culling is an accepted practice and are given contrary advice. These spores are air-borne and spread easily - & yes, it's irritating to say the least, that people who do not follow good plant hygiene put everyone at risk. Ever get disease ridden seeds in a trade? - well, that's someone who believed there's no right and wrong way of cleaning seeds!!!!
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Post by darthslater on May 9, 2011 21:48:22 GMT -5
I concur Sur4, when the season is over, I pull ALL plants up roots and all, and take it way out back in the center of one of my big fields, and burn all of it. Then, I get the soil ready for the following year. I would not even think about composting ANY plants from a previous year.
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Post by blackthumb on May 10, 2011 12:49:10 GMT -5
www.longislandhort.cornell.edu/vegpath/late_blight_pasa2011.pdfHere is a great article by an excellent pathologist who has done alot of work on LB. I don't know what else to say - folks ask for advice on culling volunteers to control it - of which culling is an accepted practice and are given contrary advice. These spores are air-borne and spread easily - & yes, it's irritating to say the least, that people who do not follow good plant hygiene put everyone at risk. Ever get disease ridden seeds in a trade? - well, that's someone who believed there's no right and wrong way of cleaning seeds!!!! Who says there is no right and wrong way of "cleaning" seeds? The objective isn’t to “clean” the seeds, the object is to sterilize disease without sterilizing the seeds. The point is that some of the official stance seems to be arbitrary, and some of it is actually counterproductive. Having to rely on commercial greenhouses and foreign or commercial sources for seeds seems to be actually increasing and spreading disease. When officials make arbitrary rules that are often wasteful and can actually increase disease; those officials lose some of their credibility.
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Post by willyswoodpile on May 10, 2011 13:40:20 GMT -5
I concur Sur4, when the season is over, I pull ALL plants up roots and all, and take it way out back in the center of one of my big fields, and burn all of it. Then, I get the soil ready for the following year. I would not even think about composting ANY plants from a previous year. Thank you for that advice Darth.
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surf4grrl
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Organic farmer
Posts: 99
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Post by surf4grrl on May 10, 2011 17:37:27 GMT -5
Tangential much? Why does accepted practice and common sense turn into a conversation against "commercial greenhouses/commercial seedsman"? Heck, it's Obama's fault! I'm not saying we should rely on anyone but ourselves actually, blackthumb! (nice name BTW) Um, by following good plant hygiene, field cleaning, cover cropping, and seed cleaning we can avoid disease and stop trading/getting "bad" seed. WTH does this have to do with commercialization? My neighbors who may or may not follow the same protocol (same goes for seed saving - I've gotten crappy seeds many times before from other "home growers") - puts everyone in jeopardy. Is that not clear from my statements? Again, cleaning seeds is a euphemism for sterilization - are you seriously arguing this point with me? But whatever - I guess the finer points of the thread are lost on you - yes, people are saying there is no "right" and "wrong" way to cull, or to clean seed, or keep/scrap volunteers. Oh sorry, wrong terminology for you our science PhD - not clean but "sterilize" our seed. Have a magical day!
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