Indian Stripe Heart

[bluelytes]

Heres the one of the two Indian Stripe I got from PAPA VIC. Not bad for a heart shape.



And my infected Danas Dusky Rose:


Best;
bluey

[GunnarSK]

Did you find Indian Stripe Heart yourself, or is it the result of PAPAVIC's breeding?

Gunnar

[carolyn137]

Sept 26, 2010 5:11:07 GMT -5 GunnarSK said:

Did you find Indian Stripe Heart yourself, or is it the result of PAPAVIC's breeding?

Gunnar

I sure would like to know if it "just" appeared or if PV squeezed a beefsteak normal form to make it a heart.

PV, what say you? You know I'm a heart lover and you also know that Indian Stripe is one of my fave tomato kids.

Carolyn

[PVP]

Carolyn, I have no idea what's up with that heart 'cuz I haven't seen it appear from my seeds here at home.

The seeds appear to be crossed with a heart, but I don't remember growing a black strawberry shaped heart so they are not F1.

In fact, I cannot remember ever growing a true strawberry tomato but have grown, but have grown some sausage shaped tomatoes in the past few years. Also, Ludmilla's plum.

But it's a total mystery to me.

I guess next year will tell if it was environmental or genetic.


PV

[darthslater]

What? no hard time about that being a heart, well I'll be the monkeys uncle!!! Wait a minute, it doesnt look quite right, are you sure thats "Black" you know they don't exist looks a little Rosa,malina, rouge......pulc....

[carolyn137]

Sept 14, 2010 21:00:24 GMT -5 bluelytes said:

Heres the one of the two Indian Stripe I got from PAPA VIC. Not bad for a heart shape.



And my infected Danas Dusky Rose:


Best;
bluey

Just curious but you said what you showed was one of two heart shaped ones. Were all others on the same plant non-hearts? And did you have just one plant or were there more plants of IS than that and did the hearts come from one plant or different plants?

I can't help being interested b'c I like IS a lot as Bill knows as well, and I'd like an IS Heart if indeed it's something genetic and not environmental.

I have seen fruits elongate into a pseudo-heart due to weather, but I've not seen one that assumed such a nice heart shape, rather, they got a pointed tip at the blossom end but the whole fruit was not a heart.

Yeah Dean, I call that one heart shaped; you'll just have to live with it re your "black" heart. ;D

Carolyn

[tomato]

with that much of a point, it has one of the heart genes. Be an interesting one to keep seed and grow next year.

tomato

[PVP]

Yes, Mulio, I've seen that from time to time when I've grown out commercial hybrids.

A couple I remember were Merced in the F3 and Ultra Boy F2. Seems like there must be a gene the breeders are using to tighten the blossom scar maybe. You think? Like when they use the nipple gene.

Anyway, I've never seen it in Indian Stripe. So, I guess we need to grow out the seed in a place where we have a more extended season than PNW. Maybe then we can get enough span on the production to observe and report more extensively.


PV

[darthslater]

Sept 27, 2010 20:35:38 GMT -5 carolyn137 said:

Sept 14, 2010 21:00:24 GMT -5 bluelytes said:

Heres the one of the two Indian Stripe I got from PAPA VIC. Not bad for a heart shape.



And my infected Danas Dusky Rose:


Best;
bluey

Just curious but you said what you showed was one of two heart shaped ones. Were all others on the same plant non-hearts? And did you have just one plant or were there more plants of IS than that and did the hearts come from one plant or different plants?

I can't help being interested b'c I like IS a lot as Bill knows as well, and I'd like an IS Heart if indeed it's something genetic and not environmental.

I have seen fruits elongate into a pseudo-heart due to weather, but I've not seen one that assumed such a nice heart shape, rather, they got a pointed tip at the blossom end but the whole fruit was not a heart.

Yeah Dean, I call that one heart shaped; you'll just have to live with it re your "black" heart. ;D

Carolyn

Easy to live with as you are the only person that doesnt think its a heart, it is identical in shape to all the Anna Russians I have grown, so unless you want to reclassify Anna Russian as a paste I suppose the only words you can say to yourself is "Touchee".

[tomato]

Darth, That does NOT look one bit like the shape of Anna Russian.

tomato

[darthslater]

Not Blueys Dar, mine!! Here it is...end of the argument Carolyn.

[tomato]

Just to toss a "it ain't over till the fat lady sings" metaphor into your lunch, here is a decent heart shape tomato for comparison and it is very comparable to the IS heart photo shown.
www.tomatogrowers.com/2005/5539.jpg
and just for the record, I've seen a LOT of photos of Anna Russian that were NOT Anna Russian. One of the better seed sellers happens to have a photo labeled Anna Russian that is not.

DarJones

[darthslater]

Well, I hope I have good Anna stock, I am concerned now I got my original seed from Sandhill Preservation. This was a very good tomato and the fact is that was one of the parents besides Black from Tula.

[darthslater]

I am also no stranger to hearts, i have grown thousands of them, and there is variation even on the same plant, some will be blunted, some will be pointed. I have had plants with almost "perfect Strawberry shape" But all the hearts I have grown have variation. Example: This is an Everetts Rusty Oxheart , I got the seed last year from Marianne Jones, notice it is more of a blunt type. All were similar. I also had a pink heart almost perfect shape out of Vorlon, yes Vorlon.



Vorlon Pink HEART

[carolyn137]

Someone recently sent me seeds for a heart shaped Orange Minsk, a wonderful variety that Andrey sent me which is normally a beefsteak and which I listed in the SSE Yearbook and also gave away seeds in my seed offer this year.

I couldn't quite determine if it was the ONLY heart shaped one found and have already told the person that I wondered if it would grow all hearts but wasn't all that positive it would.

But, there's always a chance it could be a somatic mutation and b'c of that I'm going to grow it out next season.

After all the variety Yellow Risentraube arose from just ONE yellow fruit on a plant with all others being the normal red.

And I feel the same way about this IS Heart, if someone would kindly send me seeds for it I'd like to grow it out to see if it gives hearts or is due to environmental conditions. Considering the fact that TWO hearts were found and knowing that somatic mutations are rare, I doubt the IS one is a somatic mutation, but I still would like to grow it out to see what I get.

Of all the plants and varieties I've grown over the years I've only seen two somatic mutations. One was with the variety Green Gage where one branch had all red fruits while the rest of the fruits were the normal yellow color. And the second one was with Dix Doight de Naples where one branch had red fruits but the shape of them was entirely different from the normal shape for this variety.

It just depends on where the the cell is in the plant where the DNA mutation took place as to whether a single fruit or a whole branch, or I suppose if the cell in which the mutation occurred was down low on the plant perhaps all the fruits might be different. But I haven't seen that happen to date.

And it's the reason I asked how many plants of IS were put out and were the two hearts on the same plant, etc.

Carolyn, wishing she were younger and more physically able these days so she could go back to growing the normal number of plants and varieties she did until the Fall of 2004 b'c there are so many interesting crosses and varieties being developed these days that she has no room for. And besides, the person who now has to do all her gardening for her doesn't always agree with what CJM would like to see done with her plants. ;D